When we empathize with a story, we may lose sight of the bigger picture.
I wanna talk about some stuff today. Logan and I, we were recording a bunch of little clips, for you guys and we started to notice a theme. And the theme is that we have been behaving like, the most irrational species of animal on this planet, when it comes to COVID-19. We have been fear-driven, politically driven, empathy driven and I’m gonna talk about that, which I think is terrible. I hate empathy so much, Logan, I hate it, and the reason is what we’re gonna talk about.
And in this mess, we have actually lost any rational dialogue, any ability to listen to scientists, without assuming everybody’s got an agenda, and without shaming people, whether it’s about masks or whether it’s about distancing, or whether it’s about what their beliefs are, we need to transcend that, and look at the situation rationally, without fear and empathy driving everything, and let’s explain.
So, over the last few days I’ve done a series of interviews, that I have really highlighted, really good thinkers in the space, on every political spectrum, but they’re all looking for, “What do we do? “What’s the answer to this problem of COVID-19.” And they’re all coming at it with really good intent, with really clear thinking and open to opposing ideas.
And so the first person we talked to was Vinay Prasad, and we were really talking about, how science has been censored, and how if you say something that’s politically inexpedient, you can get canceled just for doing research, that questions things in the wrong way that violates dogma. That is a recipe for bad science. It’s a recipe for shutting down conversation. What’s driving it? I think honestly, it’s quite clear, between cable news and the fact that, the mainstream media is actually a click bait generator, and social media which has polarized us into camps, where everybody else is a NPC, a Non Playable Character in this video game of life.
And you can do anything you want to them online. Everything people share on Facebook, and these other platforms, is a political polarized garbage piece. And if you look at mainstream media, every single piece has a deep bias one way or the other. What we’re missing is just going, “You know what,” “here is multiple sides to this. “There is multiple ways to solve this problem, “using actually data and you can interpret data differently, “but we need to have the conversation, “assuming good intent on all sides.”
So, that was Vinay Prasad, then I had Monica Gandhi on my show from UCSF. Now UCSF is classically, it’s in a very liberal city. And I know because I trained there, right, a lot of the folks who are drawn there, are drawn there around issues of equity and justice, and serving underserved populations and things like that. So, that’s kind of the political angle, that people tend to come from. But what Monica said is, “Look, if you’re looking at something like masks,” and she’s an infectious disease professor, “what really becomes important is looking at data, “and understanding correlation, “doesn’t always equal causation.” So you see, you start masks and the cases drop. Well, is that because masks cause cases to drop, or is it because they were dropping anyways? And then you have to go, “Why would cases drop with masks? And go through, here’s a theory. Here’s a hypothesis.
Maybe the amount of virus you breathe in matters, not just to whether you get sick, but to how sick you get and whether you develop immunity. And if that’s true, it might be that we could ask maybe the average Joe, to put a mask on if they can’t socially distance. And that would act as a kind of a almost a vaccine, by allowing a low level of exposure, ’cause we know cloth mass aren’t perfect, at preventing anything, but they allow a lowering of the viral count, and thereby building up herd immunity, meaning immunity in the community, that means the virus can spread around.
Well, herd immunity has been politicized, because if someone likes Dr. Scott Atlas, tells the president, “Let’s look at different herd immunity strategies.” Which he hasn’t really directly said, but let’s say he had said that everyone’s like, “Well then herd immunity must be terrible.” If you’re against the Trump administration say, right? But what is herd immunity? And there’s a video coming out on this. You know, it’s the resistance of the population, to further infection and it’s not a single number. It varies based on are people distancing? Are they wearing mass? How much innate immunity is in their community? Is there a vaccine? Has this virus been seen before? And what we’re seeing is the answer to that for COVID-19, is, it’s complicated. We don’t know for sure and it depends.
It may be in New York city, we’ve already achieved something close to it, even at a low prevalence of 25%, of the population being infected but we don’t know, and we need to discuss this openly. Even talking about natural herd immunity, is a political dagger, if you’re triggered by that sort of talk, and why should that be? We ought to be rationally talking about, every way to get out of this.
And so Monica’s approach was, “Well, with masking,” and it doesn’t have to be a mandate. It doesn’t have to be you forced the population, to do anything. You say, “Listen guys, this is why masking helps you. “Not just people around you, you, “by lowering your viral inoculum that you’re exposed to, “making sure you don’t get as sick. “And if you do get infected hopefully developing immunity.” And again, this is a hypothesis but let’s say it’s true. What’s the downside of wearing mask? The people who say masks make you sick and all that. There’s no evidence that’s credible that says that’s true. So, let’s talk about that, right?
The next guest we had on our show is Dr. Jay Bhattacharya. So, Jay and by the way I encourage you guys to go through, and watch the full interviews for all of these. The transcripts are there on zdoggmd.com, so you can read them if you don’t want to listen. You don’t have the time or you can listen to them on iTunes or your favorite podcast platform at 3X, or whatever speed you process information at, because they are the full nuanced discussions, that the mainstream media will never ever give you, because it doesn’t generate clicks, you can’t throw a click bait title on it easily, and it shows the person talking, as a thoughtful rational person who has something to share, that can help you make decisions. Not a battle, not a political axe to grind, not a quick soundbite, not an attack but science.
And so Jay’s interview was all about, hey, early on he coauthored some studies, on how prevalent is this new source coronavirus, in the community. And the Santa Clara study was the most controversial, because there were questions about it its methodology, and how they recruited people and that sort of thing. BuzzFeed was attacking his family for helping recruit. I mean, it’s crazy stuff. But the truth is there’s been replications in other trials, and they seem to according to Jay, converge on a general prevalence in the community, that says, “This thing was pretty widespread.” So, this idea that in the United States, we were gonna be able to squash it through suppression, was farfetched. But by knowing how far and wide the thing is spread, you can calculate how fatal really across all ages is it.
And we know it’s not equal. Elderly people it’s much more dangerous than young people. Much more dangerous for a young person, you are under 24, you’re 36 times more likely to die, in a car accident than you are to die of COVID. For an elderly person you’re twice as likely to die of COVID than you are to die in a car accident. It matters how old you are. But what Jay was saying is that means, the infection fatality rate all around, is somewhere between two and three in a thousand. That’s 0.2 to 0.3%, two to three times on average a flu season, although we don’t really know what flu’s mortality is, because of the way we calculate that data, all right?
So, that being said you then have to ask rationally, “Okay, so what are the downsides of our response?” The downsides of our response and Logan, is there any main comments I should hit right now? Nothing. Logan’s laughing at some of the comments which is good. That’s a good sign. How many people are watching right now? Going to see. 2,700 people across platforms. So, in the middle of the day that’s really great.
So, the downside of our response has been, our social fabric is fraying. We have people in the streets protesting. We have children not going to in-person school, who are dependent on meals. We have a whole cadre of people that have lost their jobs. We have small businesses that will never return, because of what’s happened. We have ripped open the fabric of our lives and our society, for a risk that in the beginning it wasn’t clear, and of course we were scared, and we were doing anything we could, to prevent a 3% mortality which would have been devastating. Millions of people dead just in the US, and it turns out that’s not true.
So, now we need to look at this and go, “Okay, is it appropriate to shame people, “for not wearing masks? “Is it appropriate to keep our schools closed? “Is it appropriate to not allow hair salons, “to open with masking? “Is it appropriate X, X, X, X, X.” We don’t know the answers but we know that, we better be asking these questions civilly. I’ll tell you what I think. I think the answer to all of those is, no, it’s not appropriate because we misunderstand risk, and the reason is and this is what I brought up, in the top of the show, Empathy.
Empathy is feeling somebody else’s pain, or suffering as your own. Feeling it, that’s called an affective empathy. When you feel someone else’s pain, and this is very important to understand, you don’t feel a whole tribe’s pain. You don’t feel a population’s pain. You feel one or a small number of people’s pain, ’cause that’s how empathy works. Empathy as Paul Bloom has written is a spotlight, that shines on an individual. And that spotlight loves individuals, that feel like the person trying to be empathic. Your same race, your same tribe, your same sex. A father if you’re a father, a mother if you’re a mother. You empathize with those folks much more, than you empathize with someone starving, in a far off continent who has a different culture, and a different look from you.
So, empathy already has this downside, of being focused on tribe and individual, and being so narrow. Now, the second problem is you feel that pain as yourself. Now, how does this apply to what’s going on in COVID. Watch the news. Read an article. It doesn’t matter pick your choice, Fox News, CNN, let’s start with CNN. CNN, “Children are dying of COVID.” They show a story of a young child who was otherwise okay, died of COVID whatever, right? The whole story, right? And your heart goes out empathically to that family, to the child, as a parent you feel it. And then what happens? Emotions well up and you go, “We better shut down those schools because this is terrible. “We could have prevented this death.” That’s empathy, all right? And I’m using a CNN example, ’cause we’ll go on the left, all right?
Well, can you empathize with the hundreds of thousands, of children who by the way are at very low risk, from contracting this disease? The flu kills more children than COVID-19. Can you empathize with the thousands of children, that are missing meals? That are experiencing anxiety and behavioral problems? That are stuck at home with abusive parents, that normally they would have a relief they go to school? That are forced to use technology, going to Taco Bell wifi, because their parents can’t afford internet at home? That are losing already, the little bit of ground they’ve gained, to rich kids who can hire tutors? Can you empathize with that? Can you empathize with that concept, that abstraction? Or do you empathize with the child on the ventilator, and the parent’s crying?
That’s what the mainstream media sells you is empathy. And what ends up happening? So much suffering in the world, that could have been prevented, if we ditched empathy for compassion. Compassion is love and understanding and concern, in the face of suffering. And that means it can be broader. It never exhausts you like empathy. It doesn’t burn you out. It is understanding someone’s pain, not taking it as your own and going, “Okay, what is the most compassionate thing that we can do, “to relieve the most suffering, “in the most people in the world?” And that’s what Jay Bhattacharya was talking about, as a health economist. That’s what he’s concerned with. His compassion not empathy.
So, what is the right do? Let’s pick a Fox News thing. “Oh, small business goes out of business, “because of COVID restrictions, “while Nancy Pelosi goes and gets her hair done at a salon.” Well, now what? You empathize with that small businessman, who built his career over a whole lifetime, of trying to make this thing happen and now it’s wiped out, when actually the data says, “Well, probably the risk of infection in that facility, “of people wearing mask isn’t that high.” But then you’re emotional, because well, people aren’t wearing mask, and there’s anti mask and this and this and this, and emotion, emotion, emotion. “We should open everything up. “This thing’s a hoax. “They’re trying to destroy the economy, “so that Trump won’t win.”
What’s the compassionate answer. Yeah, small businesses are suffering. Maybe we should have used some of this money, that we’ve squandered to support better, and more directed our small businesses, instead of Southwest or the big companies, that were getting. And maybe we should actually open up quickly, based on the new data and maybe say, “You know what, “companies can decide but masks are probably a good idea.” If only even if it’s just a placebo, if it gets us to open up and allows us, to continue to save the economy, open things back up, get kids back to school, we ought to be doing it. And that is just the compassionate answer, right? And so empathy has been a poison.
The mainstream media has been a poison. If you never opened your computer or watch TV, you would not be bothered by what’s going on, would you? You would go about your life. You would modulate your risk, based on seeing friends get sick and saying, “You know what, “I think maybe I’ll distance, wash my hands. “Maybe I’ll throw a mask on, ’cause I know people that are sick.” Which means the community you’re in, has a higher rate of infection and it’s appropriate, right? As opposed to some rural area that doesn’t yet have it.
We don’t have these conversations. We’re mean to each other. We open up social media we share the most polarizing stuff. And there’s no reason to do it, except it makes us feel good. And our Uber Lords at Facebook and YouTube and wherever, realize that that’s what generates ad revenue. Is more clicks, I’m complicit. I make my living on social media, because through ad revenue and supporters subscriptions, that’s how I make my living. I see patients for free. I don’t want the conflict of interest. I wanna be able to say what I can. I don’t want an employer telling me, “You’re gonna be fired if you say something.” So, I’m beholden to you but why?
Because you’re addicted to social media. I mean, I sometimes don’t sleep at night, thinking about this. Do you know why? Because I’m a hypocrite. Because I don’t use social media. I find it to be a poison. I don’t use my personal Facebook account. People try to message me there and I’m like, delete. I don’t use personal Instagram. I don’t use any personal Twitter. I use it all to get my messages out, and receive a butt-ton of hate in return. And I’m a hypocrite because I’m telling you, “Hey, tune into this latest video on Facebook or YouTube.” And we’re simulcasting right now, and there’s comments coming in and all right. And that’s gonna make me ad revenue, so that I can pay all this and continue to bring the… I mean, this is the problem guys, but it can be better if we all get woken up, if we wake up. I don’t know, Logan, should we take comments? What do you think? Are they just garbage? What’s going on? Let me grab a few here. What do you think?
[Logan] that it’s the global globalist conspiracy.
[Dr. Z] Globalist conspiracy, that’d YouTube I bet. Heidi Ann says, “We put the dick in addicted.” I actually, I love the fans so much. Let me read a few. “Common sense should prevail, “but common sense can’t be taught so you have or don’t.” Well, Raylene actually common sense can sometimes fail us, because the actual truth may be contrary, to what our intuition says, which is why I think some people get criticized, for going with intuition, and then the science says something different. Now, remember the science is also a bludgeon, that the left likes to use. Like, “Why don’t you believe in the science?” Because what science are you believing in? “Cause there’s science that says, the infection fatality rate is much lower than you think, which means we ought to be opening up. Do you believe that science? And you could ask the question. This was asked by Vinay Prasad “Okay, if you’re gonna study, “do African-American doctors who take care of black children “have less fatalities in that population, “than white doctors?” And there was a paper that purported this. It was terribly designed using a broken dataset. And he said, “Okay, okay. Let’s just say that it was valid. “What happens if you do that same research, “and you find the opposite. “You find that say women who take care of patients, “kill more patients.” which by the way the opposite, has been suggested in research papers. Are you gonna publish that in a climate, where you would get canceled for saying something, that isn’t politically expedient? Why are we conflating politics and science? Now I get it because politics is how you work out, disagreements in policy based on the scientific data. That’s fine but why are we taking the scientific data, and censoring it based on our politics one way or the other? It’s insane you guys. It’s not okay. Let’s read some more comments here. Guys, this is great to see, both YouTube and Facebook comments.
[Logan] YouTube is a little more lit.
[Dr. Z] YouTube is lit, yeah. See, for example, Juliana on YouTube says, “There’s no infection.” Now, Juliana, I’m gonna tell you something right now. I’m gonna tell you to your face. You are absolutely delusional. And this has nothing to do with empathy or compassion. As a physician we see that this thing is a real thing, but here’s where you’re onto something:
Compassion means that a doctor or healthcare professional, or a nurse who sees all the suffering on the front line, can actually step back and see the bigger picture, and go, “Okay, what I’m seeing, “is the sickest of the sick here in my hospital. “What I’m seeing is a subset of people, “that are ill with this. “What I’m not seeing is the suffering, “that the response is causing. “So, instead of going out there, “shaming people for not wearing masks, “and tutting people to stay home, “and holding the entire population hostage, “based on what I’m seeing with empathy here, “I’m gonna look compassionately and go, “Okay, what’s the bigger picture? “I’m gonna listen to all the data, “and I’m gonna talk about it.” Instead what happens is we shame the F out of people, and then people like Juliana, who don’t know any better, clearly, say things like, “There’s no infection.” That’s a response to how idiotic, our public health community, our communicators and our leaders have been, period. If that exists, Juliana saying, “There’s no infection,” this is a fundamental failure, of understanding and communication, because that is the single most ridiculous statement, that anyone could make if you knew anything about, what’s actually going on. Hope that makes sense. And I hope I pissed everyone off.
“My dad’s a doctor in the UK. “Why don’t you tell the truth?” It’s Juliana again. Oh, so your dad’s a doctor Juliana, okay. In the UK that has one highest per capita mortalities, from coronavirus which you’ll deny, that that data is correct. That’s fine. We can argue about those things.
Let’s see, “Mental health is suffering very badly,” says Mike Tayu, “much worse than the virus now.” I agree with you. I can’t make assertation about what’s worse and better, because I don’t have that data. You can’t granularily get into mental health data, but you could say that, I will tell you mental health is suffering, because I get thousands of messages saying, “My mental health is suffering.”
Thank you for speaking rationally on the show, right, to try to at least not polarize it as much as you can, except for that I just called Juliana an idiot. So, let’s see. Let’s scroll down here. Alexandra says, “Dr. Z, can you talk about why postpartum moms, “can’t bring their newborns to appointments, “but mothers can be present for peds appointment? “What’s the COVID logic? There isn’t any if people are doing that, Alexandra. The chance of dying from COVID as an infant newborn, are like minus a thousand. It just doesn’t happen in a realistic way. But how important is it for an infant, to come to an appointment? Infinitely important. We’re not vaccinating our children. Polio is gonna come back. All the things we vaccinate against we’re not doing, ’cause people are scared to go to the doctor, and the doctors are, “Don’t bring your newborn.”
Come on, dude. How much fear can you propagate, that’s not based on science or compassion? It’s based on bullshit, empathy, empathy. Oh, I saw once a story about a kid who got sick from COVID, and gave it to their grandpa. It’s hurts. It hurts my heart you guys. It really does. Logan, show me where on here you saw, how many people are watching. Can you see it somewhere? Oh, great, okay, good. So, 3000 people are still totally watching. That means we haven’t pissed everyone off yet or we have.
Look at this Langdon, “Clicks, clicks, clicks, “equals dollars for this dick.” This dick right here. I like that.
“UK mortality is 0.92% estimate for this year, “630,000 population,” says Radice Law. “67 million data from end of August, 66%…” I don’t know what that means. I read something that it’s a bunch of numbers, but I can’t interpret them on the fly.
Let’s see. “I’ve been able to bring my kids, “to all doctor’s appointments,” Says Ashley MK. “She needs to find a new doctor.” That’s right, you need to find a new doctor, right? And look, here’s something. This is kind of important. Matt Sullivan says, “There’s 2,600 of them on Facebook, “and the rest are on YouTube.” That’s cool. Anti-Vaxxers, I’m gonna come back to that, hold on. Ben Smith, “My attending and internal medicine, “said he won’t recommend the Moderna vaccine, “if it comes to fruition,” perfect timing, “because the mRNA vaccines are too new and untested. “How can we convince the public if doctors are skeptical?” Ben Smith.
Great question. All right, let’s talk about this. I’ll tell you what. I agree with Anti-Vaxxers. Yes, I just said that. I agree with Anti-Vaxxers in the following sense, I’m pulling up your comments. Never take anything at face value. Worry about other motives for why people are doing things, including scientists and pharmaceutical companies, and those kinds of things, and question everything, yes, absolutely. The difference between that and a hardcore Anti-Vaxxer, who’s made a living out of this more or less, is that no data will ever convince the Anti-Vaxxer, because they’re not listening to data. They’re listening to this (points at heart). They’ve already made an emotional decision. They don’t trust government. They don’t trust corporations. They’ve somehow been hurt at some point in the past. Someone hasn’t listened to them, a doctor, whatever it is. They perceive that their child was injured by vaccines, when statistically it’s more likely, that it was something else that happened at the same time, for example, autism. And with all that they now cannot be convinced, and no amount of data will do it, but time sometimes will, listening to what they’re actually feeling, appreciating that and being compassionate to that.
I have had many, many, many people message me and say, “I hated you. “You were an asshole. “You condescended to us and as you started to change a bit, “and be a little more open to, “why it is that we feel this way, “I started listening and I decided, “I’m gonna at least get one vaccination for my child. “The one I feel is most important, whatever it is. “And I wanna thank you for being the one, “who helped me do that.” And that single message for me, undoes thousands of hateful, vile, poisonous messages, in an instant. And the reason is it proves something, which is we’re creatures of the heart, with a little data thrown on. And if we recognize that, we can be understanding to each other, and then become more data driven, more rational.
Now this mRNA vaccination, I’ve talked to Paul Offit. He’s hated by anti-Vaxxers and he and I agree. We’re not gonna take anything unless we look at the data, and we’re convinced they studied enough people. The safety signals were strong and it’s efficacious, because a vaccine, unlike a lot of other medical interventions, is something you do to healthy people. Imagine the harm you could cause if you get it wrong, which is why everyone’s saying, “Don’t rush the vaccine.” Now, here’s where I will criticize directly, the president’s approach, all right? I’m not criticizing the president. I’m criticizing the approach that they’ve chosen to take, which is, “Hey guys, we will have a vaccine, “by the end of the year or by election day, “or by whatever it is.” Now, what that does is it creates a valence, of political charge, around something that was a scientific pursuit. “Let’s look at the safety data, “and when it’s done and we’re comfortable, “is when it’s done and we’re comfortable.” “We didn’t put an arbitrary date on there. “We didn’t speculate. “We just said, okay, this is what it is.” And that’s how you do it, because now what happens is the left goes, “I’m not gonna take that ’cause it’s a Trump vaccine.” Like, look what Biden’s saying. “These are the things that need to happen right.” So, this is the problem when you politicize this pursuit. And the left does this too, right? I’m not just picking on Trump. So, this is the problem, right? So, now the whole vaccine thing is this crazy, 40% of Americans say they’re not gonna take it. It’s like, “Well now look what we’ve done. “Now we’ve generated mistrust on other vaccines, “which have been around for decades, “and have proven safety and efficacy.” The truth is, this is my take on Moderna Vaccine. If I look at that phase three data, and I talk to experts like Offit and Hotez, and they tell me, “You know what, “I’m gonna go get it because of this.” Or, “I’m holding off because of this.” I will bring that to you, and I will be the first to either do, or not do that vaccine publicly, all right? So, there’s that? I wish these clowns were paying me but they’re not. What do you think, Logan. You got any more there?
[Logan] Somebody asked, “If you could advise the president, “what would you tell him, course of action?”
[Dr. Z] Course of action so that–
[Logan] If you were Fauci right now, Z.
[Dr. Z] What would I do? Okay, so Logan, since he doesn’t have a mic he basically… I just realized that, oh, you can hear, okay. What would I do if I was advising the president, if I was Fauci? This is what I would say. I go, “Donald, listen, bro. “Here’s the thing. “We need to, when we talk, “actually display a little bit of nuance. “So, we need to say, ‘You know what, this is hard. ‘It’s complicated. ‘There are smart scientists that are working on it. ‘They don’t all agree. ‘The data is unfolding, Americans but here’s the thing. ‘When the scientists are comfortable with a new vaccine, ‘it’s the most patriotic thing in the world for you to do, ‘to go get that vaccine because you are gonna protect, ‘not just yourself but vulnerable people, ‘from the effects of this virus. ‘And it’s the vulnerable people have a huge risk, ‘and the younger people the much less. ‘So, it’s a way you can help your country open up, ‘get past this. ‘We celebrate reason and science when it really works. ‘And I understand if you’re scared to take it. ‘We’re gonna go through that. ‘When we have more data I’ll be the first to tell you, ‘what the scientists are saying. ‘And we’ll go through it together. ‘And you know, this isn’t a Democrat thing. ‘It’s not a Republican thing. ‘This is an American thing, ‘that we need to figure out together.” And that’s what I would advise. And then you can use that bully pulpit of the presidency, to actually foster some less divisive stuff. Now, it’s hard because this is not how politics works, on either side. There are very few statesmen who do that or do it well. So, I bet I’d be laughed right out of the office by Kushner. David Fayetteville says that, “You’d be fired in five minutes.” It’s true.
[Logan] You sound like Aaron Burr right now.
[Dr. Z]I sound like Aaron Burr, that’s right. Yeah, just go on whichever way the wind blows man, exactly. ♪ I wanna be in the room when it happens. ♪ ♪ The room where it happens, ♪ ♪ The room where it happens. ♪ Marchelle Kramer says, “What are Stars Money?” Stars is a thing you can do on Facebook, where you send us a little tip. It’s like a penny per star that we get, and we use it for drugs and hookers. “It’s an Illuminati thing, son,” Andy Lauren. Of course it is, all right. Logan, did we do a thing?
[Logan] We did a thing.
[Dr. Z] We did a thing. I think–
[Logan] Also my Facebook crashed.
[Dr. Z] Your Facebook crashed. So, I think that’s a sign. We saw 3000 people watching us but I think we did a thing. Guys, so here’s my final thing. Can we like do the compassion thing? I mean, love in the face of suffering, assuming people have good intent, even when it’s hard to make that assumption, and you feel everything in your political heart is like, “No, this guy’s being bad.” What if you just assume they’re being good, and they’re doing the best they can. and they’re hamstrung by this and that and the other thing. And we searched for truth. We listen to the different sides. We argue in a civil and non condescending way, as much as we can and I’m not perfect at this guys, you know this but I’m trying. And I think if we try together this thing will… you know how Trump’s always like, “I think it’s gonna be gone.” I think he’d be right if we just did that, honestly, I really do because we’ll get it right, all right? I love you guys. This was fun for me. I don’t know about you. Logan, was it fun for you?
[Logan] It was but there was aluminum in em, in vaccines just saying
- There’s aluminum, minum, minim. What can you do? All right, guys. I love you all so much. Stay woke, stay safe, stay frosty. I got the “itis” after lunch, man I’ll tell ya. No diggity. All right, I love you, we up.